neal traven+[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]pitt.edu You're only young once, but you can be
traven[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]vms.cis.pitt.edu immature forever. -- Larry Andersen
--Natalie (maynor[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]ra.msstate.edu)
Date: Fri, 18 Jun 1993 09:42:00 -0500
From: Natalie Maynor maynor[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]RA.MSSTATE.EDU
Subject: And More On Corn Meal Mush
Date: Fri, 18 Jun 1993 08:48:59 EDT
Sender: English Language Discussion Group WORDS-L[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]uga.cc.uga.edu
From: Paul Barfoot PBARFOOT%SUVM.BITNET[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]uga.cc.uga.edu
Subject: Breakfast etc.
To: Multiple recipients of list WORDS-L WORDS-L[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]uga.cc.uga.edu
I've never lived in the South but I love grits (I also like potatoes
for bkfst). My all time favorite bkfst, however, is kippers on toast.
As for cornmeal mush, the way I make it is to put yellow corn meal
and some water in a pan and cook it slowly over a pan of boiling
water until it softens. The consistency is somewhat stiffer than
grits. It's great on a cold morning (with real butter and real maple
syrup). Folks in this area have been eating maple and corn together
for 1000 years.
I think I may have asked this here before (a couple years ago), but
does anyone outside of Central New York know about salt potatoes
(small potatoes cooked in brine until they are crusted with salt
on the outside - must be served with lots of cold beer)?
Br Paul
--Natalie (maynor[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]ra.msstate.edu)
Date: Fri, 18 Jun 1993 16:24:26 GMT
From: Michael Everson EVERSON[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]IRLEARN.UCD.IE
Subject: Attn: Listowners
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Thanks,
Michael Everson
School of Architecture, UCD; Richview, Clonskeagh; Dublin 14; E/ire
Phone: +353 1 706-2745 Fax: +353 1 283-8908 Home: +353 1 478-2597
Date: Fri, 18 Jun 1993 14:06:07 EST
From: Boyd Davis FEN00BHD[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]UNCCVM.UNCC.EDU
Subject: Re: corn meal mush
Louisville area in 50s; my grandmother fixed it the night before (descriptions
from Words-L tell how), fried it in the morning, served with maple syrup. I
did not know that 'mush' had the prefix 'corn meal' until now, and was
very surprised the first time I ordered polenta to find out it was quite
similar. (But then, I didn't know that 'hominy' and 'hominy grits' were
different, either --)
Boyd Davis fen00bhd at unccvm.uncc.edu PS James, where'd you go to hschool?
Date: Fri, 18 Jun 1993 17:04:00 EDT
From: "Dennis.Preston" 22709MGR%MSU.BITNET[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]uga.cc.uga.edu
Subject: corn meal mush
Although my parents were from southern Illinois, I didn't eat no corn meal
mush at home or at any friends house neither -- Louisville, KY area 1940-63.
Dennis (no mush) Preston
22709mgr[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]msu,bitnet
Date: Fri, 18 Jun 1993 23:30:08 CDT
From: "Donald M. Lance" ENGDL%MIZZOU1.BITNET[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]uga.cc.uga.edu
Subject: Re: corn meal mush
I don't remember how my mother made cornmeal mush, but I very clearly
remember thinking, when I was in the first grade, that it was the hot
breakfast cereal that poor people ate. Others would talk about oatmeal and
I didn't know exactly what it was except that kids who didn't wear hand-me-
down clothes talked about eating it.
I think Mother simply put some salt, maybe a pinch of sugar, some butter or
cream in with the meal (which was from corn we'd taken to have ground, general-
ly) and cooked it in an open stewpan till it was ready to eat.
My mother was born in southwestern Arkansas from South Midlanders (names:
Miller, Ralls, Nelson, Martin) who over several generations made their way
from the Carolinas to Arkansas -- Millers through Alabama, Rallses through
Missouri. DMLance, U of MO
Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1993 09:11:00 EDT
From: "James_C.Stalker" STALKER[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]MSU.EDU
Subject: Re: corn meal mush
Thanks for the replies. I was curious because I only had the concoction at my
grandmother's. She did generally call it 'mush' without the 'corn meal', but
did use both terms. I was wondering whether she made it from grits rather
than corn meal because her mush was white, which would suggest either grits or
white corn meal as the original ingredient. As is clear with the other
messages, mush certainly went a long way. We ate it as a breakfast cereal and
then again sliced and fried. Is there anything else to fry stuff in but bacon
grease? All this mushing about would have been going on in the late 40s. And
indeed, in KY at that time, I assumed that mush was socioeconomically graded.
Poor kids ate it, and because of that, my mother never fixed it. Cod liver
oil she would give us, but not mush.
stalker[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]msu.edu
Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1993 12:14:00 EDT
From: "James_C.Stalker" STALKER[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]MSU.EDU
Subject: receipt for corn meal mush
I checked my cookbooks to see if any of them had a recipe for cmm. None of my
Southern cookbooks do, but The Joy of Cooking does, for any of you who might
want to try this rarified dish.
Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1993 12:42:50 EST
From: Boyd Davis FEN00BHD[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]UNCCVM.UNCC.EDU
Subject: Re: receipt for corn meal mush
I'm still mulling over the socioeconomics of cornmeal mush and wondering at
what point do we conflate rurality and socioec. While they may often be
the same, there's no guarantee --
for example, I'm sure I ate cornmeal mush in the late 40s in Ky on my
grandparents' dairy farm (below Valley Station, outside of Louisville) but
don't remember it until the early 50s. Mush was two things: something to use
up extra corn/grits AND something that you could eat if you didn't have
anything else. So it could indicate surplus of produce as well as undersupply.
I expect that mush probably is a socio-ec 'index' --
and wonder if the liver-mush so popular in this area of N.C. may also be. I
note that it is carried in the fancy as well as the cut-rate groceries, but
is made almost exclusively by one particular company (in what used to be a
small, rural town in the state). Would 'scrapple' (which I've never eaten)
be a similar socioec indicator up nawth? I'm musing over projections, atti-
tudes, correlations -- Boyd Davis fen00bhd at unccvm.uncc.edu
Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1993 15:01:00 EST
From: ALICE FABER FABER%LENNY[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]VENUS.YCC.YALE.EDU
Subject: Re: receipt for corn meal mush
Would 'scrapple' (which I've never eaten)
be a similar socioec indicator up nawth? I'm musing over projections, atti-
tudes, correlations -- Boyd Davis fen00bhd at unccvm.uncc.edu
Well when the LSA was in Philadelphia, the hotel restaurant had scrapple on
the breakfast menu as an alternative to bacon, ham, or sausage. It's obviously
an acquired taste, and one conference was not long enough to acquire it!
Alice Faber
Faber[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]Yalehask.bitnet
Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1993 16:40:00 CDT
From: Beth Lee Simon BLSIMON[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]MACC.WISC.EDU
Subject: Re: the socioecon of mush and souse
Boyd,
Yes, I think there is a term difference too. Moving from
mush, think of "head cheese" (if you can, or will). While head cheese
is definitely an acquired taste, souse, and some other terms name made
foods that poor/rural folks ate because the materials were cheap or
unwanted by others.
(In Madison, polenta has begun to appear on a number of menus,
while mush certainly has not)
beth
blsimon[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]macc.wisc.edu
Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1993 16:41:44 -0700
From: "Joseph B. Monda" monda[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]SEATTLEU.EDU
Subject: Re: the socioecon of mush and souse
On Sat, 19 Jun 1993, Beth Lee Simon wrote:
Boyd,
Yes, I think there is a term difference too. Moving from
mush, think of "head cheese" (if you can, or will). While head cheese
is definitely an acquired taste, souse, and some other terms name made
foods that poor/rural folks ate because the materials were cheap or
unwanted by others.
I wonder if it's also a matter of passing time, as well. some of the
terms are obsolete --mush because we mostly eat dry cereals these days, I
suspect. We are in the fast food era.
I wonder whether "porridge" would go over big in a yuppie restaurant.
(In Madison, polenta has begun to appear on a number of menus,
while mush certainly has not).
We have a place noted for its gargantuan (and expensive) breakfasts. In
fact it was the location for some of the Twin Peaks episodes. Anyhow,
they package and sell rolled oats as a luxury food item.
Incidentally, busloads of Japanes tourists visit the site. Twin Peaks
(and Northern Exposure --also filmed near here) is big business. So it goes.
Joe Monda
Date: Sun, 20 Jun 1993 21:44:19 -0500
From: Dennis Baron baron[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]UX1.CSO.UIUC.EDU
Subject: Re: corn meal mush
--
I tried to send a reply a couple of weeks ago in response to the other
dInnIs' note about something or other but it didn't work--perhaps your
internet address is no longer operative, so I'll swithc to bitnet.
I'm no expert on corn meal mush, but I've had mameliga (not sure
if that's the right spelling) a couple of times in my life, once
at Ratner's (which is in southern Manahatta) and once at the home
of a Romanian composer of electronic music (in North Champaign, IL)
and this ethnic dish much touted by my Romanian ancestors who always
likened it to corn mean mush, since its a cornmeal dish (I can't
go back and fix punctuation on this editor very easily, sorry) is
simply awful. SOrt of like Wheateena without the flavor. Hmm.
Dennis
--
debaron[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]uiuc.edu (\ 217-333-2392
\'\ fax: 217-333-4321
Dennis Baron \'\ __________
Department of English / '| ()_________)
Univ. of Illinois \ '/ \ ~~~~~~~~ \
608 S. Wright St. \ \ ~~~~~~ \
Urbana IL 61801 ==). \__________\
(__) ()__________)
Date: Mon, 21 Jun 1993 00:22:42 CDT
From: "Donald M. Lance" ENGDL%MIZZOU1.BITNET[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]uga.cc.uga.edu
Subject: Re: the socioecon of mush and souse
I suppose I started the socioeconomic thing on cornmeal mush. My memories of
it are primarily from the 1930s, Depression times. We also ate souse, but that
was because my paternal grandmother (1/2 Welsh [Wadkins], 1/2 Irish [Leeper])
made it. She may have made it because of the German background of the paternal
side of the family (Lance Lentz). I remember helping her get every solid
morsel from boiled parts of the heads and other parts of a couple of hogs we'd
butchered. I always liked it but didn't think of it so much as Depression
food as a delicacy that only my grandmother knew how to do well. I was about 5
when I was helping her. My mother didn't like to make it, I suspect partly
because of what went into it, but maybe because it takes a lot of work to make
it right, or maybe because the neighbors with whom we later shared butchering
pleasures didn't like it. Ah, the good ole days! DMLance
Date: Tue, 22 Jun 1993 12:18:36 -700
From: Warren Keith Russell keru[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]CPU.US.DYNIX.COM
Subject: Re: receipt for corn meal mush
On Sat, 19 Jun 1993, Boyd Davis wrote:
small, rural town in the state). Would 'scrapple' (which I've never eaten)
be a similar socioec indicator up nawth? I'm musing over projections, atti-
tudes, correlations -- Boyd Davis fen00bhd at unccvm.uncc.edu
I assume I'm considered "nawth." I grew up in Southern Alberta; I didn't
know what 'scrapple' was till I looked it up just now in my Merriam-Webster.
I have found this cornmeal mush discussion most enlightening. My
grandfather moved to Canada from Alabama, but apparently didn't pass the
recipe on.
------------------