Date:    Wed, 1 Apr 1998 12:16:23 -0600
<br>From:    Thomas Creswell  creswell[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]CROWN.NET 
<br>Subject: Re: THIS X SUCKS and fellatio
<br>
<br>Any concrete or hard evidence that fellatio is the primary underlying reference
<br>in This X Sucks is obviously not to be found in Nexis or the Archives of the
<br> New
<br>York Times or even in the citation files of well edited dictionaries.  The
<br>expressions "To Suck Cock" and "Cocksucker" rarely, if ever appear in such
<br>edited,printed  contexts.
<br>
<br>The written evidence for such terms is, or was, largely to be found in washroom
<br>epigraphy, and the best concentrated source of such evidence, although dated by
<br>now, is Allen Walker Read's  _Classic American Graffiti_, published originally
<br>in 1935 in a private printing of 65 copies by Allen himself, and republished by
<br>Reinhold Aman's _Maledicta_ 1977.
<br>
<br>sv _cock_, the following, all given with location and date of  reading of the
<br>inscription,
<br>occur:
<br>
<br>"Who wants to get his cock sucked off."
<br>"My cock is only 10 in. long so if anyone would like to suck, meet me."
<br>"I have a big cock and I like to have it sucked."
<br>"I suck big cocks for fun."
<br>"Learn to spell, kid, you big cocksucker."
<br>"Ashes to ashes and dust to dust,
<br>   suck you cocksucker your cock can rust"
<br>"... so if anyone would like to suck meet me . . .
<br>  [Other handwriting] suck it yourself you big cocksucker"
<br>"All cocksuckers register here"
<br>
<br>Allen Wal;ker Read's inscriptions were all collected during the late 20's and
<br>early 30's in visits to the washrooms of National Parks, railway stations, and
<br>other public places.
<br>
<br>Evidence of the healthy survival of _cock_ in the sense "penis" is found in
<br>RHHDAS, which supplies citations dating from 1450 to 1920.  For  _cocksucker_,
<br>there are
<br>citations ranging from Farmer and Henley 1898 to the late 80's in various
<br>sources.
<br>
<br>All the preceding is evidence of wide, even though not often printed use of
<br>_cock_ and _cocksucker_.
<br>
<br>What was in the mind of the clever teenager(?) who first said "This X sucks"
<br>cannot, of course, be known.  But the frequency and currency of _cocksucker_
<br> and
<br>_to suck cock_ are so well established and widespread in 20th century male oral
<br>(please excuse) usage that the likelihood that any other source underlies the
<br>expression "This X sucks" is quite remote.
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>RonButters wrote:
<br>
<br>  In a message dated 3/31/98 4:05:33 AM, salovesh[AT SYMBOL GOES HERE]niu.edu wrote:
<br> 
<br>    It wasn't what came after the word "suck" that made a difference: it was
<br>  the elided predecessor that made sense to these kids.  THEIR context was
<br>  the word "cocksucker" and its derivatives.   
<br> 
<br>  Maybe; maybe sometimes--but how does one KNOW this? Is there any evidence
<br>  other than anecdotal assumption and projection (usually not from the users
<br>  themselves, but from their shocked and horrified teachers and parents)? I
<br>  grant you that when a high school student in 1965 read Shakespeare's "Where
<br>  the bee sucks there suck I" he or she may have associated "sucks" with
<br>  fellatio--or nursing--or childish all-day-sucker activity. But what CONCRETE
<br>  evidence is there that fellatio is primary?
<br> 
<br>  PS: My spell-checker just asked me if I would like to add "cocksucker" and
<br>  "fellatio" to the dictionary. AOL is sooo prudish!
<br>